Vector,

There has been a bulletin to dealerships about modified ECM and TCM's, my question is does your stealth tune keep the correct checksum figure that they are looking for, and when you return the vehical to stock, does the same Checksum Figure that was there before the tune get put back to what they would be looking for. I have included the Bullitin below, this was taken from the posting by mi04se1, in thread:
http://www.g8board.com/forums/showthread.php?t=21002
If you have any helpful comments about this i think that anyone on this board would be appreciative, and help settle the question about whether tunes are "dectable" :quoties:or not.

Thank you mi04se1 for posting this in the first place.




xTooltipElement
Service Information
2009 Pontiac G8 | G8 Service Manual | View All Bulletins | Document ID: 2365177
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

#09-06-04-026A: Identifying Non-GM (Aftermarket) Engine and Transmission Calibrations for V8 Gas Engines - (Oct 28, 2009)


Subject: Identifying Non-GM (Aftermarket) Engine and Transmission Calibrations for V8 Gas Engines


Models: 2006-2009 GM Passenger Cars and Light Duty Trucks (Excluding Saab 9-7X)

2006-2009 HUMMER H2, H3

Equipped with V8 Gas Powered Engines Only



Attention: This bulletin applies to V8 gas powered engines ONLY. For all other gas powered engine applications, refer to Corporate Bulletin Number 08-06-04-033C. For Duramax™ diesel powered engines, refer to Corporate Bulletin Number 08-06-04-006F.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

This bulletin is being revised to add a graphic and information about the Tech 2® screen displaying all zeroes and add Warranty Information. Please discard Corporate Bulletin Number 09-06-04-026 (Section 06 - Engine/Propulsion System).


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

General Motors is identifying an increasing number of engine, transmission and catalytic converter part failures that are the result of non-GM (aftermarket) engine and transmission control calibrations being used.

When alteration to the GM-released engine or transmission control calibrations occurs, it subjects powertrain and driveline components (engine , transmission, transfer case, driveshaft and rear axle) to stresses that were not tested by General Motors. It is because of these unknown stresses, and the potential to alter reliability, durability and emissions performance, that GM has adopted a policy to cancel any remaining warranty coverage to the powertrain and driveline components whenever the presence of a non-GM (aftermarket) calibration is confirmed - even if the non-GM control module calibration is subsequently removed.

Warranty coverage is based on the equipment and calibrations that were released on the vehicle at time of sale, or subsequently updated by GM. That’s because GM testing and validation matches the calibration to a host of criteria that is essential to assure reliability, durability and emissions performance over the life of the warranty coverage and beyond. Stresses resulting from calibrations different from those tested and released by GM can damage or weaken components, leading to poor performance and or shortened life.

Additionally, non-GM (aftermarket) issued engine control modifications often do not meet the same emissions performance standards as GM issued calibrations. Depending on state statutes, individuals who install engine control module calibrations that put the vehicle outside the parameters of emissions certification standards may be subject to fines and/or penalties.

This bulletin outlines a procedure to identify the presence of non-GM (aftermarket) calibrations. GM recommends performing this check whenever a hard part failure is seen on internal engine or transmission components, or before an engine assembly or transmission assembly is being replaced under warranty. It is also recommended that the engine calibration verification procedure be performed whenever diagnostics indicate that catalytic converter replacement is indicated.

In May 2009, the PQC will begin piloting a process to confirm the ECM/PCM calibration is GM issued. Beginning on May 18, 2009, the PQC will require a picture of the engine calibration verification screen, as outlined in this bulletin, before authorizing any V8 gas powered engine replacement.

If a non-GM calibration is found and verification has taken place through GM, the remaining powertrain and driveline warranty will be cancelled and notated in GMVIS and the dealership will be notified.

Connect the Tech 2® to the vehicle.
Go to: Diagnostics and build the vehicle.
Select: Powertrain.
Select: Engine.
*Select: Engine Control Module or PCM.
*Select: Module ID Information or I/M Information System if the Module ID Information selection is not available.
*If "I/M information System" was selected, it may be necessary to select "Vehicle Information" in order to display the calibration information.
⇒ If the CVN information is displayed as "N/A", it will be necessary to contact the TCSC (1-800-828-6860 English or 1-800-503-3222 French) to obtain the CVN information.





Take a CLEAR digital picture of the Tech 2® Vehicle Information screen showing the engine Calibration IDs and Verification Numbers as shown above. Retain the printout information and the Tech 2® screen photograph with the repair order.
E-mail a copy of the picture to tacsnapshot@gm.com (tacsnapshot@gm.com). In the subject line of the e-mail include the phrase "V8 Cal" as well as the complete VIN and Dealer BAC. In the body of the e-mail, include the VIN, mileage, R.O. number and BAC. Include a brief description of the customer concern and cause of the concern.
Note: The dealer will receive an email reply after the calibrations have been validated. The email reply will advise the dealer if the calibrations are OEM.

Allow two hours for the PQC to verify the calibrations and set up the case details.
⇒ If the PQC determines that the calibrations ARE aftermarket calibrations, DO NOT contact GM Technical Assistance to discuss warranty concerns on the aftermarket calibrations. ALL questions and concerns about warranty should be directed to the dealers Fixed Operations Manager (FOM), (Warranty Manager (WM) in Canada).

You may call the PQC two hours after submitting the e-mail for authorization to replace the assembly. This will provide them time to receive, review and set up a case on the request. Please be prepared to provide all the usual documentation that is normally required when requesting an assembly authorization from the PQC.
Tech 2® Displaying All Zeroes for the Verification Numbers on the Calibration ID and Verification Number Screen




If the Tech 2® that you are using displays all zeroes for the Verification Numbers as shown, then perform the following steps:

Update the Tech 2® with the latest software from TIS2WEB.
Turn OFF the ignition for 90 seconds.
Connect the Tech 2® to the vehicle.
Turn ON the ignition, and build the vehicle. Observe the Tech 2® Calibration ID and Verification Number screen for proper operation.
⇒ If the Tech 2® screen still does not display properly, then turn OFF the ignition for 90 seconds again. Turn ON the ignition and observe the same screen for proper operation.

Warranty Information
• The Dealership Service Management must be involved in any situation that would justify the use of labor operation Z1111.

• Notify the Fixed Operations Manager (FOM) (Warranty Manager (WM) in Canada) of the situation.

• All claims will have to be routed to the FOM (WM in Canada) for approval.

• Please refer to Corporate Bulletin Number 09-00-89-016, Labor Operation Z1111 - Suspected Tampering or Vehicle Modifications for important information.

For vehicles repaired under warranty, use:

Labor Operation
Description
Labor Time

Z1111
Suspected Tampering or Vehicle Modifications
0.2 hr

GM bulletins are intended for use by professional technicians, NOT a "do-it-yourselfer". They are written to inform these technicians of conditions that may occur on some vehicles, or to provide information that could assist in the proper service of a vehicle. Properly trained technicians have the equipment, tools, safety instructions, and know-how to do a job properly and safely. If a condition is described, DO NOT assume that the bulletin applies to your vehicle, or that your vehicle will have that condition. See your GM dealer for information on whether your vehicle may benefit from the information

Kirk answered this numerous times. He said the dealer cannot detect the tune with the stealth option.

Kirk answered this numerous times. He said the dealer cannot detect the tune with the stealth option.

Yes i have seen those answers but never seen a referance to the specific data that the dealers would look for in the case of major engine repair as referanced in the article you posted. I was hoping for a definitetive answer on that specific checksum, that the article refers to.

:search:

I should get a tech 2 here at work and try it, but Ill take Kirk's answer.

We have tested our stealth calibrations with the Tech2 and the new MDI on the new Camaro. No worries so far:)

Can i assume you used the Tech2 and procedures posted above. Did you then also return to stock tune and check as well? Sorry to be a pain.

If they're willing to stand behind it if it is found is what I'd love to know. In other words if you run their tune and your engine blows and GM finds it will they step up to the plate and put in a new engine cause they gaurentee that GM can't see it? This is the only way I'd ever consider getting one, if they don't want to stand behind it then that makes me have to wonder how confident they are that its TRUELY a stealth tune.

Different people say different things.

Some say they can detect it (if they look hard enough)
Some say they cant (no matter how hard they look)

I personally would like the REAL, FINAL, 100% TRUTHFUL ANSWER as it relates solely to G8s. I could care less about other GM brands or other Makes.

If there is ever 100% definitive proof of this- I would LOVE to see it stickied and in bold letters. SCREAMING READ ME.... because honestly I want to know,


Until I hear more- I am going to take them at their word, that undetectable tunes are undetectable- otherwise Livernois, Vector, and other companies who claim this would be fraudulent to advertise something that is false.

and I think they both seem like stand up companies, who have done nothing but been helpful to the G8 community. So I believe them.

I currently have a Superchips Cortex. If I return my G8 to stock with the Cortex and then get your tune, will it be detectable?

I currently have a Superchips Cortex. If I return my G8 to stock with the Cortex and then get your tune, will it be detectable?

No.

Kirk,
If I return my G8 to stock with the Cortex BUT DO NOT get your tune, will the removed Cortex tune be detectable?

Kirk,
If I return my G8 to stock with the Cortex BUT DO NOT get your tune, will the removed Cortex tune be detectable?

Why would Kirk entertain this question if you aren't going to purchase the VMS tune?

Hey I still have the stock tune and just wanted some info on the topic. I just wanted to know.