I've been in love with the G8 since I heard about it. But recently, I discovered the one problem with it that could seal its fate in America: public opinion.

I overheard a few people at a local campus talking about it, in a negative manner.

"Have you seen the new G8? It looks great, but it only has 362 hp out of 6.2 liters. Didn't the old GTO get 400hp, on six liters?"

I stopped at talked to them, and afterwards they were impressed with the G8, but there in lies the problem: I can't talk to everyone.

Something we all know: cars that displace more tend to get worse mileage, they just do. Its not to say the mileage wouldn't be close, but the exact car they were talking about, BMWs 5 series, does get better mileage than the G8's predicted mileage with the 4.8 Liter and has similar power(two wholly different price points I agree, but still)(and yes the G8 has more torque total, but the 4.8L still builds plenty at a decently low level).

Not everyone knows the power differences, or that the L76 is still going to get nearly as good of mileage as the 4.8 Liter from BMW. But therein lies the problem: people look at the LS2 and say "hey, that had more power, and here GM is trying to sell us a bigger engine that will get worse mileage and has less power."

What it took for me to convince these kids was to tell them that 1. the engine runs on 87 octane, the LS2 recommended 91, and two: the L76 has more potential than the LS2.

So, what does this look like to other, normal consumers? The enthusiast market will eat up the G8, but normal consumers, I'm not sure. Anyone else see the disconnect here?

"The Public" is going to love this car! And it's 6.0 liters not 6.2

Has that ship landed in Cali yet!??

Scryer.....that's the reason I started the "lets discuss advertising" thread. It's imperative that Pontiac gets the message through from day 1 if the G8 is going to succeed.
Mike P........shouldn't the term be docked?........:wall:........it ain't a plane ya know...j/k

The cars leaving port and being off loaded when they arrive are events that GM should take advantage of and post on various sites.

The Week of Christmas would be a good time to start a decent ad campaign.

First of all, the G8 has a 6.0L V8 - not a 6.2L.

Second, your average consumer doesn't usually compare things like that - IMO. Most people don't remember the GTO and they certainly won't recall that previous C6 Vettes had a 6.0L V8 that made 400HP. Current Vettes have a 6.2L that makes 430HP - they will either know that, or they will ask their salesman who might know that.

Point being, there's no direct rift in powerplants. The thing that most people will be able to easily associate is that the G8 takes 87 and the LS-motors take premium.

Huh, it is 6 Liters. Where did those kids get 6.2? From the LS3 or something? :huh:

Anyway, still, I think we all see the problem here..... and even if, as one person mentioned, we get the word out that it doesn't need premium fuel, it still doesn't change that everyone is going to look at the smaller, import V8s and say "huh, what?"

But I digress, lets take this over to the advertising thread (which I am sorry that I passed over olly).

Not sure why you think it will get worse gas mileage than a GTO b/c the G8s L76 6.0l has cylinder deactivation and a 6speed auto.

Also someone has deep enough pockets I say go ahead and buy a BMW, I won't stop them, it's their money not mine. Oh yeah I saw a new M5 on the lot last night with a sticker of $99,000.

No one but people one GM boards like these is comparing the G8 to M5. Although the G8 clearly wins on torque and size, thats about it. The cars are in wholly different classes with completely different missions.

No one but people one GM boards like these is comparing the G8 to M5. Although the G8 clearly wins on torque and size, thats about it. The cars are in wholly different classes with completely different missions.

This is true. The BMW mission is to take as much of your disposable income as possible and still make you think you made a wise decision!

:gr_devil:

No one but people one GM boards like these is comparing the G8 to M5. Although the G8 clearly wins on torque and size, thats about it. The cars are in wholly different classes with completely different missions.


Not true. On the TV show "Top Gear" they kind of pit an M5 vs. the Vauhaull VXR8 (not the G8, but close).

The G8 can definitely be compared with a regular 5 series BMW V8. Its a great bargan for the same 'type' of car.



link to top gear vid

http://www.ls2g8.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8249&postcount=7




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Not sure why you think it will get worse gas mileage than a GTO b/c the G8s L76 6.0l has cylinder deactivation and a 6speed auto.I'm not saying it will get worse mileage, but it sure won't get better.

More fuel efficient engine + heavier car + auto instead of manual = tradeoffs

Not true. On the TV show "Top Gear" they kind of pit an M5 vs. the Vauhaull VXR8 (not the G8, but close).

The G8 can definitely be compared with a regular 5 series BMW V8. Its a great bargan for the same 'type' of car.



link to top gear vid

http://www.ls2g8.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8249&postcount=7




...

My dad has an '06 M5. When I get my G8 I will compare them. I can tell you that the two don't get close to comparing. The M is in a class all it's own.

I will even compare it to his 335I.:yumyum:

And don't forget that the horsepower for the GTO was rated under the old method. The G8 is rated under the new SAE method which makes is seem like a larger difference than it actually is.

Im not sure that will be a problem. I think this G8 will appeal to a larger audience, and will capture a lot of status oriented drivers, such that I have met, that don't pay as close attention to the 0-60 times and hp numbers as they do to the readily visible numbers like 6.0. To them, the car will be exactly as fast as any other vehicle that has a 6.0 ltr engine, and most definitely faster than a 4.8 ltr car. Yeah, I know, it don't make sense, but these people are out there, they only care enough about the cars numbers in order to brag about it. They will never see a speed contest.
:monkee:

The G8 GT presents ( it seems to me ) both a unique challenge & a unique opportunity for Pontiac.

It seems clear that, based on the HP \ TQ, weight & gearing, that Pontiac will have ( in the GT \ V8 version ) something that comes close to being in the BMW 545 \ 550 class - in acceleration.

Yet the actual transaction prices ( assuming a discount off MSRP that is close to what’s been typical for Pontiac & GM ) will be many thousands less than even BMW 535 prices. ( The 535i base MSRP is just over $50K. And the 550i starts at $58.5K. )

Is someone that can afford & would typically look at buying or leasing a $50K+ sedan even going to be aware that the G8 GT exists?

And if so, will they be open to the suggestion that the acceleration is accompanied by interior fit, finish & materials are at least of sufficient quality to be worthy of consideration?

Of course, the rest of the G8’s dynamics ( handling, ride, braking, etc. ) must be proven capable – in addition to the straight line quickness.

But assuming that is accomplished - Will Pontiac be able to convince such a potential buyer to seriously consider the G8 GT?

Or will Pontiac aim ( only ) at those buyers potentially considering a Dodge Charger or Magnum?

If Pontiac can successfully market the G8 GT – and establish a reputation for performance & perceived quality & reliability - at a much more reasonable price than BMW, I see a bright(er) future for the brand, over the next few years. . .

I happened to “step up” this time to a $50K-ish car. A 2007 Corvette Coupe, with options that pushed the MSRP to just over $50,000. Yet I believe that I would likely be very happy with a G8 GT – next time I trade.

Particularly when I make the payments . . .

We shall see.

- Ray

Wondering what ** IS ** the next introduction from Pontiac, after the G8???

Wondering what ** IS ** the next introduction from Pontiac, after the G8???

G8ST (sport truck)
G8SW (sport wagon)
AWD versions of all G8s (fingers crossed)

Ford sees the G8 as a competitot to the 500/Taurus. I see it, like many, as a BMW-class vehicle at a bargain price. Not all BMWophiles are as true to the brand as one might think. Plenty of households with X5s and Altimas sharing the garage.

There are not nearly enough G8s scheduled to be built to replace sales (including fleet) of the outgoing GP, even at another 17% annual reduction in sales. Without some other changes in the mix Pontiac will drop below Buick in domestic sales and may become in Oldsmobile-type jeopardy.

Even as the newest Epsillon, Malibu debuts with enough praise that declares it a better Accord, people are blind to fact that it is simply a rebadge of eth G6. The G6 is due next for an upgrade in size and performance - possibly leading to a rwd Pontiac the size of a CTS. Rumors are that we also will see a smaller sedan, our version of the Caddy BLS. Max Bob has implied as much.

G8+Pedders+Magnacharger >M5 for still half the price.

G8+Pedders+Magnacharger >M5 for still half the price.

Yeah right... Power wise maybe...

Yeah right... Power wise maybe...
from my experience and those who i know that have and have had bmw's... i will say these few things as both my own opinion and a carry over of theirs...

bmw
1.electrical problems that are out of this world
2.problems do occur on a regular basis with these cars and fixing is very expensive (bc not everything is under warranty... they find their way out of it)
3.cheap materials and alot of creaks and groans
4.not worth the money

out of 5 of my friends who have had or have bmw's, 4 said they would not get them again (m5, m3, 335i, x5 4.0) for reasons said above and 1 said he would keep his (m coupe) and is happy.

im not saying the g8 is going to be bullit proof either, but from what the gto showed us (good fit/finish, good price, great materials) i am faithful that the g8 will show us the same great features brought to us from down under.

so of course, saying that the m5 or whatever will not be a good comparison for the g8 would be totally opinion based bc in my world, the g8 sounds more appealing. i will never own a bmw. if i go foreign, it will be lexus or infiniti for me!

chrish

Yeah right... Power wise maybe...

Then I can guarantee you that you have not driven a GTO with a Pedders package. The driving experience will be on par, with a good interior quality, especially for the money.

I would give the M5 the nod for all the high end Tech but it comes at a huge price.

Even comparing the G8 to the M5 is a huge compliment to the Pontiac.

Just my opinion but I would rather have a G8 with 10K in extras (magnacharger, pedders, stereo, etc), plus a new G8 ST and a new dirt bike for the same price as the M5.

Then I can guarantee you that you have not driven a GTO with a Pedders package. The driving experience will be on par, with a good interior quality, especially for the money.

I would give the M5 the nod for all the high end Tech but it comes at a huge price.

Even comparing the G8 to the M5 is a huge compliment to the Pontiac.

Just my opinion but I would rather have a G8 with 10K in extras (magnacharger, pedders, stereo, etc), plus a new G8 ST and a new dirt bike for the same price as the M5.

Enjoy!

As for all the electrical problems...

My father has 3 BMW's currently. He has had 4 BMW's in his life and had nary a problem with them... He is not one to buy a car just because of what it is. He goes for looks, performance and overall reliability.

Creaks and groans? HUH? They are built like a vault. The M and moms X5 are the quietest vehicles I've been in.

I guess all I can say is that I love German cars. I would own one but due to my job I need to own an American built automobile.

Remember that I am looking at buying a G8 GT so I am on your side here I just can't see comparing a 35,000 dollar car to a 100,000 dollar car... I am all for the G8 spanking the M5 or even a standard 5 series but I don't think it offers the same level of overall performance and design from the factory.

I know full well though that when you start modifying stuff IE: superchargers and such that problems aplenty arise. Been there done that...

Enjoy!

Remember that I am looking at buying a G8 GT so I am on your side here I just can't see comparing a 35,000 dollar car to a 100,000 dollar car... I am all for the G8 spanking the M5 or even a standard 5 series but I don't think it offers the same level of overall performance and design from the factory.

I know full well though that when you start modifying stuff IE: superchargers and such that problems aplenty arise. Been there done that...


good point. thats good that you like german built cars, they are nice indeed and everyone does have their own opinion and is entitled to think what they want. cant wait till you get your g8 so we can get a good comparison from a person who is non biased to one or the other! let us know when yours comes in! =)

chrish

GTO with a Pedders package.


sounds awesome wish i knew what it was like lol

ive always loved american made/manufactured cars, and im happy gm is bringing this vehicle over from down under! i loved the cts-v's, just didnt care much for the cheap interior feel. thats why i cant wait for the g8, i loved the gto interior fit/finish and im sure the g8 wont dissapoint!

chrish

sounds awesome wish i knew what it was like lol

ive always loved american made/manufactured cars, and im happy gm is bringing this vehicle over from down under! i loved the cts-v's, just didnt care much for the cheap interior feel. thats why i cant wait for the g8, i loved the gto interior fit/finish and im sure the g8 wont dissapoint!

chrish

+1 to that! From what I have read about the Goat makes me want the G8 that much more. I hope it is at least equal in quality. I have never had good luck with GM interiors so here's hoping this one turns me around... I just hope they come out with the manual. If not I will get the auto but I'm waiting for an '09. GM likes to come out a year later with a lot of good things. IE: BHP!

I guess all I can say is that I love German cars. I would own one but due to my job I need to own an American built automobile.



http://www.bmwusfactory.com/ The X5, Z4 coupe and roadster, M coupe and roadster as well as soon to be released X3 and X6 ARE American built.

http://www.bmwusfactory.com/ The X5, Z4 coupe and roadster, M coupe and roadster as well as soon to be released X3 and X6 ARE American built.

Shhh. Or they will realize he wants an Australian made Pontiac, a Mexican built Ford (Fusion), a German built Chrysler, but not the Korean built Chevy.

They probably will allow him to buy a Vibe, but not the Matrix built in the same factory.

Shhh. Or they will realize he wants an Australian made Pontiac, a Mexican built Ford (Fusion), a German built Chrysler, but not the Korean built Chevy.

They probably will allow him to buy a Vibe, but not the Matrix built in the same factory.



+1.

http://www.bmwusfactory.com/ The X5, Z4 coupe and roadster, M coupe and roadster as well as soon to be released X3 and X6 ARE American built.

Shhh. Or they will realize he wants an Australian made Pontiac, a Mexican built Ford (Fusion), a German built Chrysler, but not the Korean built Chevy.

They probably will allow him to buy a Vibe, but not the Matrix built in the same factory.

+1.


Let me explain my prior comment (not that I need to) by saying that the car can be made on Mars but the car company needs to be owned by an American company. I visit a lot of Union shops in the Midwest and they frown upon "foreign" cars and trucks in their lots. When it comes to me making a living selling to guys that pride themselves on building American equipment and products I will not shove a "foreign" car down their throat.:wink2:

Americans are by far the worst at showing loyalty for their own car companies. Germans buy something like 80% German cars and the French by something 70-80% French cars. The English also have a vast majority that buy only English makes and the Japanese overwhelmingly buy Japan, like 95%+.

While it would be nice to see more loyalty on the part of Americans for their companies, it appears we have an almost perverse pleasure in NOT buying American. Shame really.

Americans are by far the worst at showing loyalty for their own car companies. Germans buy something like 80% German cars and the French by something 70-80% French cars. The English also have a vast majority that buy only English makes and the Japanese overwhelmingly buy Japan, like 95%+.

While it would be nice to see more loyalty on the part of Americans for their companies, it appears we have an almost perverse pleasure in NOT buying American. Shame really.

The Japanese and Germans seem to have a better idea of what Americans want and/or need in a car. Cadillac is doing a GREAT job of getting the job done now. Ford (and I'm a Ford guy) has their head SO far up their back side they can't see. Bob Lutz is doing a great job turning GM around with vehicles like... Well all the new Saturns are sweet, the Arcadia, Enclave and such are great as well. Fit and finish have been my pet peeves with GM vehicles but I tend to be VERY particular. I hope this G lives up to my expectations.

Hell I bought my Saturn Vue Redline because it has the ultra smooth and powerful 3.5L Vtec Honda engine and transmission. It's the smoothest best running engine I've ever owned. As far as the Saturn's concerned... Rattle trap. I have a piece of paper wedged in between the dash and the head unit to stop an annoying squeak. The passenger seat rattles constantly and you can here the interior panels squeak when you hit a large bump. Now get in my bro's Legacy GT and it is as silent now as the day he bought it. Ugh...

Let me explain my prior comment (not that I need to) by saying that the car can be made on Mars but the car company needs to be owned by an American company. I visit a lot of Union shops in the Midwest and they frown upon "foreign" cars and trucks in their lots. When it comes to me making a living selling to guys that pride themselves on building American equipment and products I will not shove a "foreign" car down their throat.:wink2:

Got any blue point cupholders? Just guessing...

Americans are by far the worst at showing loyalty for their own car companies. Germans buy something like 80% German cars and the French by something 70-80% French cars. The English also have a vast majority that buy only English makes and the Japanese overwhelmingly buy Japan, like 95%+.

While it would be nice to see more loyalty on the part of Americans for their companies, it appears we have an almost perverse pleasure in NOT buying American. Shame really.

The last american car that was built that I would have bought new was 96 Impala SS or a Tbird SC. Everything since has been meh. Except the GTO. Wait that's foreign. But my Tacoma was built in Indiana I think. So, back in 97 i said to myself...self, no more Impalas or Tbird Sc's available. Get an M3. And i did.

Got any blue point cupholders? Just guessing...

Don't even know what they are...

Don't even know what they are...

Guess you're not the snapon guy. My Bad.:err: