Had 2-3 Shift TSB performed and... - Page 2 - Pontiac G8 Forum: G8 Forums

gr8lover · 02-04-2010, 01:31 AM

I have not forgotten about the write-up for those interested. Just got behind at work and have not had a chance to get to it. I will have something ready over this weekend. Sorry for the delay.... trying to get a bunch of Camaro 6L50's run and ran into a bunch of "opportunities"..... (for the V6 Camaro...) I will get to the 6L80 flare issue....

Gavine · 02-04-2010, 06:41 AM

Subscribed and anxiously awaiting your write-up. Much appreciated!

majesticix · 02-04-2010, 09:44 AM

Just an update on my issue, unfortunately the seal replacement didn't fix my ultimate issue, which was the poor 2-3 shift. Looks like the clutch on my tranny was damaged from my initial flaring problem and will require a rebuild to get the 2-3 to shift as crisp as possible. It's still plenty drivable and will last a long time as is, I just can't knock down torque management on that shift and makes any future mods somewhat pointless from a racing perspective since my tranny will limit the full potential.

So be forewarned, if you are having flaring problems, I suggest loading on your stock tune (or going back to 100% torque management) until you get the flare issue addressed.

I'm left with rebuilding my tranny and will likely get RPM to do the job and reinforce it when the time comes to mod up. You really can't see my problem unless you tune the car and drop TM...at this pont my 2-3 shift is set to 100%TM for the time being. I may have to do that to all my shifts eventually until things get fixed.

How the problem started: Engine was replaced and the dealer loaded on an old calibration which caused the flare (and possibly the leaky seals). Lucky for me the flare arrived on my day at the track...and stupid me ran it a few times trying to see if it was a fluke which likely f'd it up.

What can I say, I guess deep down I wanted a new tranny to go with my new motor

DRCUSTOMPARTS · 02-04-2010, 10:21 AM

So you're saying that GM won't pay to have the trans rebuilt?

AVIDMOTION · 02-04-2010, 11:00 AM

subscribe I have the 2nd to 3rd flare, dealer said no known fix hit or miss, wont go into trans until real info available. If it gets worse or other problem to bring in car then. Fair enough, as he said I have 100,000 drivetrain warranty and I really dont want them in my trans if possible.

PontiacFan · 02-04-2010, 11:19 AM

too bad the seal replacement did not fix the problem i have a feeling GM does not have a fix for this problem they need to addrss this issue.

majesticix · 02-04-2010, 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DRCUSTOMPARTS

So you're saying that GM won't pay to have the trans rebuilt?

I didn't ask them yet, but something tells me if I ask for a new tranny (or rebuild) red flags are going to be waving with all the work they've already warrantied

Also, with the stock tune loaded, the 2-3 shift problem is negligible. It's only when I drop TM that it takes literally over 2 seconds to shift into 3rd gear at 60% throttle. The tune makes it worse. So I'm going to drive around with stock TM on the 2-3 shift and see how things go.

I won't be breaking my 1/4 mile record anytime soon, but it should only be a tenth or two off my best time. Trying to minimize the wear until I can get it rebuilt. Who knows, it may get so bad over time that you can feel it on the stock tune and then I may be able to replicate it for the dealership. Until then, I'm on my own.

An RPM rebuild with labor to remove the tranny will cost less than headers, and then I could easily slap on some serious mods with the reinforced tranny with confidence. At that point though, I'll need a winter beater

(and a lot of $$$)

DRCUSTOMPARTS · 02-04-2010, 12:16 PM

If the trans isn't working right after they fixed it, then they need to make it right. Don't be shy about asking them to fix something that the warranty should cover.

PontiacFan · 02-04-2010, 12:21 PM

they will try to make it right but will only make it worse speaking from a previous experiance with Grand Prix they rebuild my transmission 3 times and everytime they did new problems came up and this was 2 different pontiac dealerships. From now on I would not let anyone go in to my transmission unless they replace it with new one.

majesticix · 02-04-2010, 12:33 PM

Well it's strange, it worked fine out of the box. Tuned it after about 1500 miles on the new engine, took it to the track and ran my best ETs. On my return visit to the track, the flare hit me. Brought it to New Era who confirmed the flare and told me to get a new calibration from the dealership who uploaded an old one. The update fixed the flare, but when Mike tried to tune it again, the 2-3 was sloppy. Wouldn't respond to increased line pressure, and at that point felt the tranny was f'd. Then I got the seals replaced just for the hell of it to see if that may or may not fix the problem. Didn't fix the problem.

So at this point, the factory defect flare was probably amplified by the tune and reduced TM, which damaged the tranny. Kind of a sticky situation. I haven't really been able to put the car through the paces with the winter tires and slick conditions, so once things warm up and I take it to the track to see what kind of damage I'm looking at, I will either take it to the dealer to see if they will rebuild, get a rebuild by RPM, or drive around as is for awhile. It still drives like a beast though.

DRCUSTOMPARTS · 02-04-2010, 01:00 PM

I would pursue having the dealer fix it, all they can say is no.

majesticix · 02-04-2010, 02:53 PM

can't hurt I guess.

Dunlin1 · 02-07-2010, 01:56 PM

Any update on the part numbers and the procedure to fix this the right way ?

gr8lover · 02-07-2010, 03:25 PM

I am sorry guys- I meant to have the info all laid out by now but just been very busy. I promise to have it done and put in Monday night Late (early Tues morning).

This fix I will lay out is the best option to have the 2-3 flare fixed. It may not solve every issue (due to some trans might have more leaks internally than others), but it will do a much better job at fixing the issue than the current "plan" from GM. This is what I am going to push GM to do for me. I am hoping that is going to go my way, but you never know. Even it you have a trans rebuilt by RPM or someone, I personally would include this change cause it will help with the leakage in the rebuilt one also. So by tuesday morning I wil have pics and numbers and everything you need. Again, I do not have any authority to do this and cant guarantee GM will allow repair per the new design, but if you have the info and have the dealer push for the parts, then we may just get them to do it. It frustrates me that GM doesnt fix it the best way possible even though it does cost a bit more to do so. You will have something on Tuesday morning.

Gavine · 02-08-2010, 06:33 AM

I wonder if a Chevy dealer will do the fix for us....(Camaro)

DRCUSTOMPARTS · 02-08-2010, 08:34 AM

Call them and ask....

gr8lover · 02-09-2010, 01:40 AM

Sorry it took so long but I wanted to make sure I had all the info I could.

There are many reasons why the flare could be happening, but the most likely is due to the Seal issue that everyone is talking about.

There was a fix implemented at GM on the following dates:
YTO (ypsilanti, mi) and TTO (toledo, ohio) on 10/23/08; and at Sialo Mexico on 11/5/08. Keep in mind almost all G8's GT's and GXP with 6L80 the trans was built in Mexico.... only the first couple thousand were built in Ypsilanti and all of the rest were built in Silao (DO not think because your sticker says transmission was built in the USA that it actually was built here.... mine said that but it was actually built in Mexico..) You can verify location on Trans tag mounted on trans--- you can see it from under the car--- if it has the letters "STO" on it-- it was built in Mexico..

I believe that the production of the G8 trans moved to Mexico in Jan 08 (could be off +/- a couple weeks...)

Also, build date on car may be very different than trans build date... due to shipping and inventories and them not using FIFO...

If you have the Flare, my suggestion is to have the pump cover/stator shaft/ and seals replaced with the new oring/ring seal setup.

The part number you should see in the list of part numbers is 24248573 (Cover kit). This includes everything required for the proper replacement of the old design to the new design. IF YOU SEE 24238248, you will be getting the OLD designed ring seals that CANNOT have ORINGS under them!!!

If they do the Cover kit, then it should fix all of the flare issues related to this seal issue. Keep in mind there are a large number of seals in and around this area and any one of them could be causing the issue (cut, rolled, installed wrong, etc...). It also could be any of the seals in the clutches, the VB, etc, etc, etc.... the fix I mention is only related to the design issue.

As for RAYAINSW who had the old design seals installed and it fixed the issue, that is great. This will work for some but not all.

MAJESTICIX: the seals that fixed RAYAINSW didnt fix yours. But I think the fix I suggested could be a better solution for your issue. If you take it in and have them do the COVER KIT and then also replace whatever clutches might be bad.,... I would ask them to fix it for you.... why not--- what do you have to loose??

STL G8GT: his car didnt get fixed even with the COVER kit (but it is weird they also ordered the wrong ring seal also.. does not make sense and the two are not compatible@@@!!! ) We are currently working with his dealer to find a fix.... this investigation might also help others with more drastic issues not related to the SEAL fix... We will keep you posted on what happens at his dealership..

Is there a 100% known fix for everyones "flare"... maybe not-- there are so many possibilities and mfg tolerances and such, that each case is different. But due to the known design improvment in the COVER KIT, I feel this is the way to go... along with a bit of verifying the other seals are in good condition.

I was going to put in pics and such but I think by having the COVER KIT number it should get you started.... PS.... I think it is also suggested that the dealer replaces adiditonal seals any time a tranny is taken apart and removed... I dont know what they are personally right now, but the dealer should have that info at hand.

Let me know if I can get you anything else. Good luck!!

DRCUSTOMPARTS · 02-09-2010, 04:04 AM

Is this fix just for the flair or does it also fix the hard 2-3 shift too?

PontiacFan · 02-09-2010, 07:56 AM

This is my Question also I dont really have flairs but I do have hard shifts

majesticix · 02-09-2010, 10:44 AM

Good info to know. I'm going to drive around on full Torque Management on my 2-3 Shift for now and see how things go. At this point I'm satisfied as a drivable issue, but from a racing standpoint, it needs addressing. Once I'm ready to take the next step as far as modification goes, I will delve deeper into the tranny unless I start to see problems again while driving normally.