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Old 09-11-2009, 08:46 AM   #1
RWD-V8
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Default Installing a WB sensor in the stock O2 bung

I would like to install a WB in one of my pre-CAT stock O2 bungs. Does anyone know of any WB that outputs both 0-1V and 0-5V to work with HP Tuners and feed my ECM a like stock signal. I believe the factory O2 sensor outputs 0-1V. I'm fine with cutting a stock O2 sensor so I can use the connector to connect into the harnes. The car is a GXP

Would I need to put a resistor across the heating circuit on the stock O2 sensor side. If so, any idea what value? Any help or links would be appreciated.
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Old 09-11-2009, 08:59 AM   #2
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Does this help?

http://www.g8board.com/forums/showthread.php?t=20537
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Old 09-11-2009, 09:21 AM   #3
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Thanks. I've seen that.

I'm trying to do it without the addtional bung. I found some WBs that output both voltage ranges. I think I can just splice into the stock O2 sensor harness signal wires and feed in the 0-1V from the WB and leave the heating circuit wires connected so it will heat as if it were in the exhaust stream. Then just tie it back to keep out of the way.
My only concerns with this is could it overload the sensor heating circuit because the O2 sensor would be heating continually heating w/o being in the O2 stream?
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Old 09-11-2009, 02:50 PM   #4
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Innovate LC-1 can do it.
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Old 09-11-2009, 03:35 PM   #5
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Just weld in a bung, it will cost like $20 and you wont have this headache.



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Innovate LC-1 can do it.
Did you call them and ask them if it could?

IMO, I dont think it can, cause I have one.
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Old 09-12-2009, 06:54 AM   #6
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Yeah, I don't want to grind the coating of carbon steel headers to TIG in the bung. I found out I can just tie the NB output into the harness input for that O2 sensor. Now I just need to fine a wiring diagram for the harness connected to the ECM. Does anyone have this or a link to it.

Also, does anyone know the P/N of the GXP ECM and where to get one at a good price. I've searched around and found conflictign P/Ns. I guess I could dig down an pull mine out. Thanks.
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Old 01-15-2013, 10:39 AM   #7
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Bump. I'm installing headers on my car tonight/this week and would rather use a wide band in place of the stock o2 so I don't have to add another bung. Ill be feeding it into hptuners eventually, just waiting for a good price on a used one to pop up. But like the OP asked, will it feed the ecm as well?

Edit: Nevermind, looks like the outputs are different. I'd need a controller to feed it back into the ecm.
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Old 01-15-2013, 02:55 PM   #8
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Juts add a bung in the right location, while the headers are out of the car. cheap and easy, and you won't have to mess with it except when replacing the WB sensor if needed later on. We have pics showing the bung if you didn't order the headers with the bung in place. you can order Kooks with an extra bung for a WB for example.
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Old 01-15-2013, 08:48 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RWD-V8 View Post
I would like to install a WB in one of my pre-CAT stock O2 bungs. Does anyone know of any WB that outputs both 0-1V and 0-5V to work with HP Tuners and feed my ECM a like stock signal.
I looked into this some time ago because I didn't want to weld on my beautifully coated Kooks LT's. The PLX WB controller does this. I bought it with the DM-6 Gauge. The problem with doing this is if there is any difference with the calibration/readings between the WB controller signal and the stock NB signal the Left bank NB readings will be different from the Right bank NB readings and these get used to control fueling for the engine. So I finally decided to leave the the stock NB's and weld a bung into the front of my High Flow CAT. It was tight and closer to the CAT than I wanted to be for the WB but it wouldn't corrupt the stock NB signal in any way. So follow the advise that many others have already provided and weld in a new bung.
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Old 01-15-2013, 09:40 PM   #10
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Get the bung welded in before the cats and do it right the first time......
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Old 01-16-2013, 08:43 AM   #11
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I deleted the cats, so I'm just going to install it in the rear bung since they'll be turned off anyway. I don't know why I didn't think of doing it that way in the first place. Is there any opinion on left bank vs right?

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Old 01-16-2013, 08:57 AM   #12
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That makes sense. I just assumed you had cats.

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Old 01-16-2013, 03:21 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brentsten View Post
I deleted the cats, so I'm just going to install it in the rear bung since they'll be turned off anyway. I don't know why I didn't think of doing it that way in the first place. Is there any opinion on left bank vs right?

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I have thought about doing this as well.
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Old 01-16-2013, 05:09 PM   #14
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Just an extra note for anyone considering using the rear bung for a wide band, you cannot do this if you still have cats. The wide band needs to be placed before the cat.

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Old 01-16-2013, 08:04 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brentsten View Post
Is there any opinion on left bank vs right?
I put mine in the drivers side. I read that cylinder 7 is usually the cylinder that goes lean. No idea why that would be, or if it's true, but I went with it.
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Old 01-17-2013, 05:58 AM   #16
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What sensor are you installing?
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Old 01-20-2013, 01:36 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brentsten View Post
Just an extra note for anyone considering using the rear bung for a wide band, you cannot do this if you still have cats. The wide band needs to be placed before the cat.
why is that?
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Old 01-20-2013, 01:40 PM   #18
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i ran the LC-1 on my mustang few years back and it was a royal pita and their reset/reteach procedure got old and am now having lot better luck with the aem setup although don't belive they would give you the 0-1v output you're looking for but obviously come with the 0-5v

also, lot of the aftermarket WB02s are not made for turbo setups and won't last as long with the added heat. i found a slick litle heat sink setup from dynotunenitrous that's increased the life of the sensors. lot of them are out of oem vw made by bosch.

pk's $0.02
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Old 01-21-2013, 07:12 AM   #19
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Quote:
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why is that?
It's what I've heard for as long as I can remember. It has to do with the post-cat emissions being leaner than pre-cat, which is where your narrowband o2s are taking readings. I found this on another website that explains it a little better.

Quote:
From the wideband sensor's point of view, post CAT gas is leaner, and the exact amount is hard to quantify in a rule of thumb. The cat is not venting fuel, but it is changing the composition of the gas - so from the sensor's point of view, which runs a pump cell to try to achieve equalibrium, the gas appears leaner.
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Old 01-21-2013, 09:01 AM   #20
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The cats use oxygen, which is what the O2 sensor measures. Therefore a post-cat O2 sensor can read leaner than the pre-cat. The exact amount is hard to determine, especially for WOT operation, which is richer than stoich - so you would think there would be NO oxygen in the exhaust stream. This of course is not true, but there is less. The cats do have some residual O2 storage, but I believe that a full WOT blast would exhaust this. Then one might think the post-cat O2 might read about the same as the pre-cat.

I have had my local dyno operator tell me that his tailpipe WB O2 reads about .1 leaner than a pre-cat. Take it with a grain of salt. I imagine he is referring only to the full WOT run and not steady-state cruising, but who knows? I hope to get a WB O2 kit installed this year and I will go to the dyno and compare my numbers with his and report back to this forum.
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