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Discussion Starter #1
over the past few months, my g8 has had intermittent starting issues. it sounds like the solenoid on the starter is clicking when the key is hit, but the starter wont turn its full cycle to start. i have pulled the starter, all tested strong ( no moisture or burns). the dealer has changed the pcm with no luck.. has anyone seen this problem or have any ideas???
 

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Since there *have* been a few starter failures on these cars (most always an outright failure), it sounds like it might be your turn here. My feeling, is that even a gimpy solenoid or starter motor would easily produce a good crank check (and give you that nothing wrong here feeling), with a no load test (which sounds like what you performed). But under a severe load (which is the norm), a weak solenoid or a bad spot in the starter rotor, could cause a no crank condition at anytime.
But to prove that out, you would have to be willing to replace that starter with a good re-manufactured or new starter assy., which is pretty expensive. For example a rebuilt from one auto parts store (with a lifetime warranty) costs $292 plus tax and turning in the other starter (or add another $10).
 

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Discussion Starter #3
I would agree it being the starter, but I have run a cheater wire from the solenoid and put up in the engine bay. When it wouldn't start, I simply had to touch the wire to the positive battery post next to the block and starts every time. So I feel that the starter has been ruled out.
 

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That's a slick move. But the bad part (so to speak) is that the starter/solenoid come as a unit for this car. Unless, you have some connection with a starter/alternator shop that can get a solenoid only for you, or a kit to rebuild your existing solenoid.




I just re-read your post again. If you figure that wire jumper eliminates the starter/solenoid as the problem OK. My read, is that you've bypassed the inside of the solenoid. Which means to me, that the solenoid portion (of the starter), is the bad boy here.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
By putting the wire on the solenoid, I've only eliminated the ignition switch, Pcm, relay, etc. The power still has to throw the contact on the solenoid and get power to the starter as it would normally. Which it does. This is why this problem has been rather long to figure. I feel that switch and relay is next.
 

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My bad. I just looked at the WD. So if you know that the fuse is solid, the crank relay is also good, and the ECM is elliminated, its like you have a so-so wire going from the relay to the solenoid.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
The only thing I haven't thought of I believe is the crank relay as you said, along with a crank sensor. If that was bad, the sensor would think the shift was out of sequence if I'm not mistaken?
 

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I don't understand the *crank sensor* thinking. As long as the car sends out a signal that *it* is in the park position, and see's that a crank request has been made (key to start), the ECM sends out the 12 volts to energize the R12 relay. Having T/S down to replacing the ECM (like you did), led me to believe all other checks of getting power to the solenoid had been tried and eliminated as a possible source of the problem.
If you want to try, you could reverse the FU2 and FU8 fuses and the R8 an R12 relays, to see if normal key starts return.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
The PCM is what the dealer had thought to be the problem. i could do the work myself, though being a busy time of year for me, thought id take it and have the problem solved quickly. i just a few minutes ago got a call saying they now think it could be a BCM?? which i have never encountered with any car ive built. i apologize for any confusion, and appreciate your incite. the relays are cheap, so will most likely go tomorrow and get the relays and replace them for good measure. i have been racking my mind for days on what is the difficulty in them diagnosing the issue.
 

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Are you sure the Transmission internal mode switch indicates park when it does this? As in, does the indicator in the cluster say P? Or is it blank? Or does it say R?


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Was this issue ever fixed? Im haveing this same problem now, new battery, new starter also. Intermittent starting. Turn and get a click. Do that 5-15 times and will start. Seems to not do it as often when its warm out or the engine is warm. Starts around fall winter time.
 

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Was this issue ever fixed? Im haveing this same problem now, new battery, new starter also. Intermittent starting. Turn and get a click. Do that 5-15 times and will start. Seems to not do it as often when its warm out or the engine is warm. Starts around fall winter time.
Could be the starter relay. When you replaced the starter was the heat shield still there on the original one? I had to buy a new shield and bolts, without it the starter gets very hot from the exhaust manifolds.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk
 

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Was this issue ever fixed? Im haveing this same problem now, new battery, new starter also. Intermittent starting. Turn and get a click. Do that 5-15 times and will start. Seems to not do it as often when its warm out or the engine is warm. Starts around fall winter time.
A poor battery ground can also cause the same problem. What brand of battery and starter are you currently using?
 

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Could be the starter relay. When you replaced the starter was the heat shield still there on the original one? I had to buy a new shield and bolts, without it the starter gets very hot from the exhaust manifolds.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk
Which starter heat shield did you purchase?

P/N 92186959 or 12629286?

OEMcats states that P/N 92186959 was replaced by P/N 12629286 for the Canadian market.

Heat shield bolts P/N 11571131 (need 3).

EDIT:

Possibly P/N 92186959:



P/N 12629286:









 

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That's a slick move. But the bad part (so to speak) is that the starter/solenoid come as a unit for this car. Unless, you have some connection with a starter/alternator shop that can get a solenoid only for you, or a kit to rebuild your existing solenoid.




I just re-read your post again. If you figure that wire jumper eliminates the starter/solenoid as the problem OK. My read, is that you've bypassed the inside of the solenoid. Which means to me, that the solenoid portion (of the starter), is the bad boy here.
The solenoid can be replaced: ACDelco #92204535

Though I'm seeing it for $92.78 on Amazon ($88.79 on RockAuto), while the replacement starter is ~$106 (~$109 on RockAuto). Might as well just replace the starter for the price difference. The bolt to attach the solenoid is 10451346 (apparently 4 in the kit; I'd verify before ordering).
 

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Which starter heat shield did you purchase?

P/N 92186959 or 12629286?

OEMcats states that P/N 92186959 was replaced by P/N 12629286 for the Canadian market.

Heat shield bolts P/N 11571131 (need 3).

EDIT:

Possibly P/N 92186959:



P/N 12629286:









I think either heat shield will work. I had to bend it a tiny bit to fit. Very hard to install the starter w/shield already attached. Was easier to install the shield with the starter semi installed. Got the bolts locally, the oem are Torx head(or Allen can't remember) and it's very hard to get a Torx socket in there once mounted.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk
 
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